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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2015 15:07:37 GMT -6
I think this album deserves its own thread.
Personally, I think it's fantastic, and maybe their best (I can't really decide for sure, all three albums are all very good). I like that their riffs have become a little bit more complex, and I also like what they've done with the acoustics this time around. To Journey With Focus in One's Gaze is my favorite of the acoustic tracks. The other interludes are awesome too, particularly Psalm of the Oceanborn and To Journey With Faith in One's Spirit. Tempest of the Great Owl is my favorite song though because I like how the structure changes throughout it.
What do you guys think?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2015 21:09:02 GMT -6
I really wanted to like it, but it's just not my cup of tea
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 16, 2015 0:57:10 GMT -6
I'll say the same thing, but in all honesty, its the same with me and a lot of Christian black metal bands.
I checked out a song from this album on Youtube. (Behind the Breathing Sea) Cool intro, and when the music kicks in at 3:29 into the track, its cool.... but that riff is literally 3 and ½ seconds long. 34 seconds later when its played that same 3.5 seconds over 9 times, I'm BEGGING for a change-up.
I might get some heat for saying something like this, and it absolutely isn't just O Magestic Winter... but even listening to newer Christian black metal releases, I feel like I'm drinking the same glass of water I did years ago.
My theory regarding that is I think that a lot of Christian black metal bands have the same conviction as some of the members here. I totally respect that from a spiritual standpoint, but it really stifles the sound of a project when the pool of musical influences is so small. To me its obvious in their sound when a Christian band only listens to other Christian bands.
Take GRIM - Scepter of Blood for example (1999, bonus track came from 2001) and compare that to Breviarium - An Overwhelming Sense, One Day (2003). Both Christian albums I made and I didn't actually practice/play a whole lot between those two releases. To me, the biggest reason those two albums (two years apart) sound so different (with Breviarium sounding more unique with better riffs and structure) is the number of listening influences I had.
I can't listen to GRIM without hearing Antestor, Kekal, Crimson Thorn, Metanoia and Mortification playing as a supergroup out in the woods and recording it with a dumpy minidisk 4 track.
When I recorded Breviarium, I had already gone secular metal "hog wild" for over a year and had literally 100 other influences from 100 other bands, all outside of the Christian realm of course. Sorry if this ruins the album for anyone, but when I recorded Breviarium, I was struggling heavily with daily drug use. (I should post the lyrics to "This Vicious Cycle" sometime - it outlines that struggle) ...and even being INTOXICATED every day, I still made better music for the simple fact that I had listened to, extensively, hundreds of bands who have hundreds of influences themselves.
In comparison to my GRIM days when I listened to 20 bands who only each listened to each other's music.
I hope that makes sense to everyone.
Also, I theorize that Christians give Christian bands more slack than secular listeners do their own music because we give bonus points to a band for just talking about our faith. I say that because I did that - I would almost forcibly "like" some bands only because it was extreme metal and Christian. ...but my heart was completely "meh" about the music.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 4:19:27 GMT -6
I know exactly what you mean. I tend to hate it when the same riff is played for minutes on end as well, and that's why I think that the first two tracks (Behind the Breathing Sea and To Journey With Hope in One's Heart) are the worst on the album. Still not bad songs, but everything else on there is much better.
Thomas, you should try listening to their other two albums: Defiling the Serpent's Temple and An Autumn Moon. Both of them are more original-sounding in my opinion.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 16, 2015 6:41:44 GMT -6
HAHA! That stuff is original! Its a lot more intense - almost grind-ish. I dig the un-production too.
Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with familiar and conventional - but if you're going to repeat a riff, make sure its a good one.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 9:42:43 GMT -6
I've listened to the album a few times now and I like it, might even share the opinion that it's their best album so far (in terms of 'most balanced album'). Maybe a somewhat cleaner production would have fitted their new songs better this time (even though I'm a fan of raw recordings). Nevertheless, I enjoy the album.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 17, 2015 15:17:45 GMT -6
To each their own. I can certainly see how someone would really like it - and what I've heard of all their music, I liked most of it.
It wouldn't surprise me if people prefer the sound of Christian extreme metal over secular. If that's what they're conditioned to.
...unfortunately, from my experience, I won't spend a lot of time with what sounds good when I hear something that (in my opinion) amazes me.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2015 16:12:41 GMT -6
Thomas, since you listen to so much secular metal, I'd like to ask you this: do you feel that Christian bands have a different sound (in general) than non-Christian bands?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2015 16:53:49 GMT -6
I think in some cases yes. For example look at bands like Amorphis, Tyr, Geist and Eis. They all are pretty unique, and quite good, and there is NOTHING like them that really compares in Christian Metal. Now Amorphis is more Death/Doom/Progressive Doom and Tyr is pure folk Viking Metal, with clean vocals. But Geist and Eis, same guys two bands, are black metal and they really are very much a step above anything in the Christian scene, for the most part. Don't get me wrong there ARE, imo, SOME Christian black metal bands that are far and above all other Christian bands as well but in general I think among the HIGH END bands so to speak, meaning the top bands in their genre, ARE much better than the norm in Christian bands. However I think that the HIGH END Christian bands would at least be able to keep up with the high end secular bands. Does that make sense to anyone else but me?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 2:04:37 GMT -6
Well for me it makes sense . I think part of why there are more unique secular bands is, that the secular scene is just bigger, so there's a higher chance to find some really talented musicians (not that I want to imply that the christian musicians habe no talent, I hope you get what I mean ^^). And when even in the secular scene, there is no other band like let's say Amorphis, so it makes perfect sense to me that in the smaller christian scend, the chances for someone playing music like Amorphis are low. I think some christian bands really don't have to hide from the secular ones, but in most cases, for me christian bands can't really compete with secular ones. For example, the christian Folk/Black Metal Bands are not bad, I really enjoy listening to some, but I have so far not heard ANY christian band in this genre that is even close to bands like Moonsorrow. But to come back to O, Majestic Winter: Truly one of the most unique bands in the christian scene! So far they sound different than any other band, but I couldn't really get into their last two albums, but I liked the teaser for Eternal Shores. Have to take a closer look soon!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 5:04:23 GMT -6
Well, when we're talking about the European and North American 'Unblack' scene, we're talking about a few people (<-- literally) running a few projects (and recording stuff in their home studios). Bands like Amorphis or Moonsorrow are professionals and therefore exceptions compared to the countless bands that are existing. Of course it isn't wrong by any means to prefer 'high-end' releases, but I think the 'scenes' can hardly be compared at all.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 7:08:43 GMT -6
The North American Christian black scene in particular is mostly one- or two-man projects. Most of the Scandinavian groups are actual bands with multiple members that are capable of performing live, and some of them can afford decent studios (Antestor, Crimson Moonlight, etc.). The rest of Europe tends to have more one- or two-man projects as well, but those projects are often capable of producing some fantastic music. I'll bring up Dormant once again, because it's just a fantastic project and easily in my top five Christian black metal releases of all-time.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 18, 2015 7:39:42 GMT -6
It really isn't fair to compare the Christian black metal scene to the secular one. Its like comparing a mom and pop grocery store to a super Walmart.
...but it still gets compared of course. I'll shop at the mom and pop shop if they have something I like, but if they don't have what I'm looking for, or I can get a better deal at a shorter drive, I'm not going to shop there. Nothing personal.
Same with Christian black metal. Its quaint, I like the concepts, I love the people and the music is good. ...but the secular scene has better performing, better produced, easier to get, better creativity, more choices/bands, etc.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 8:22:51 GMT -6
Of course, I'm not listening to stuff I'm not interested in too. But I simply enjoy quite a lot of stuff from the 'unblack' realm, mainly because I love the untamed passion of underground music and might even prefer it compared to most 'professional' releases.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 18, 2015 9:00:08 GMT -6
Its all preferences and opinion, but again. I'd say the depths of the secular underground once again has better performances and "un-production".
The below is one exampld of many that's just pure gold.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 9:43:58 GMT -6
Yeah, I listen to a ton of 'secular' underground bm too. Obviously there are more somehow exciting bands in that scene - just like there are probably more bm bands in the state I'm living in than there are unblack bands in the whole world.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 18, 2015 10:49:37 GMT -6
At least there's way more Christian black now than there used to be. Back in the day it was like... Horde. Vomoth. Kekal. Beliah... Antestor was still death/doom. That was it!
Now, I don't even know the names of all Christian black metal bands.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 12:23:52 GMT -6
Yeah, I'm glad that we have so much now, but it seems like releases in general have slowed down compared to the 2000-2010 time period.
The sad thing is that some of the older, really good stuff can be hard to find.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 15:00:13 GMT -6
I guess Crimson is right. Perhaps things are different in South America, but I can't see that many active bands or projects in Europe or North America today. No reason to complain anyway (life takes things where it goes), but nevertheless quite natural that it's a lot easier to find 'special' stuff in the regular bm scene.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 17:44:58 GMT -6
Man. When I read all of this I cannot say anything else but you guys are all true die-hards. Being faithful to a sub genre that is almost meant not to exist. Awesome.
When I think about it... 4-7 years ago I could spend hours browsing online stores/distros/mailorders etc. finding 'regular' black metal releases I never heard about. I won't find a single disc I haven't heard about now regarding unblack in any christian music webstore that is listed in the trusted stores topic. So comparing both scenes would be, indeed, completely unfair. So I hope some guys and bands and project wills rise up from their feet and dedicate their time to some good/well produced unblack music. Or just go underground and grind away. Either way I would be happy!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2015 7:18:58 GMT -6
I guess Crimson is right. Perhaps things are different in South America, but I can't see that many active bands or projects in Europe or North America today. No reason to complain anyway (life takes things where it goes), but nevertheless quite natural that it's a lot easier to find 'special' stuff in the regular bm scene. That's basically what I wanted to say! That's something I thought about too, when I really got in touch with the christian metal scene in about 2012, that the genre basically already has been at it's "peak" so to speak, even though we still have some great new bands and releases today!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2015 11:40:10 GMT -6
I am late to the conversation, but I enjoyed the new album. It has a few weak moments, but overall very good.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Apr 22, 2015 9:23:35 GMT -6
My opinion, every album has their weak moments. I just wish there was more I could hear besides the mostly intro track on YouTube.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2015 13:53:16 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2015 18:34:26 GMT -6
Its worth the money for sure, weak spots are very few
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2015 3:52:51 GMT -6
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Post by blake on May 14, 2015 13:13:01 GMT -6
I really want to pick this album up but just have not been able to afford to buy hardly any albums this year. Maybe eventually
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