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Post by thevociferator on Nov 6, 2016 15:36:55 GMT -6
okay Let's talk about songs we used to hear ALLLLLL the time back at the turn of the millennium!
here's a list of songs to get us started
Open the Eyes of My Heart
I Could Sing of Your Love Forever
Heart of Worship
Here I Am to Worship
Shout to the Lord
Breathe
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 6, 2016 16:14:14 GMT -6
I'm sorry, I can't listen to contemporary worship. I makes me cringe like no other music. Everything about it drags the listener to commercial music aspects.... which distracts from actual worship. There's also an air of ecstasy about it too, like everyone makes freakin' O faces while they sing it. There's too much into it for concert appeal as well. My heart says that whooping and clapping isn't for Christ. Its for the acknowledgement of the singers, at least that's what it feels like to me. __________________________
The only worship that fills me is what I've heard from Primitive Baptists. Its not that its aCapella. Its not that it's exactly performed well either.
Its because its devoid of personal musicianship or people "showing" to be a public eyepiece. In my heart, it feels genuine. Sincere. I could listen to stuff like this all day. THIS is trve "old" worship music.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2016 16:20:01 GMT -6
I don't mind modern worship music, but I agree that it isn't as good as what you just posted, Thomas.
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Post by thevociferator on Nov 6, 2016 17:18:59 GMT -6
Sounds like you subscribe to church of Christ ideology a bit.
I much prefer house church worship over all else. When just a few people gather around with an acoustic guitar and maybe a djembe or shakers and sing any worship song. It is truly special. The purity to that worship is far greater than any official congregational worship service
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Post by thevociferator on Nov 6, 2016 17:26:28 GMT -6
But much like that chick-fil-a post, listening to turn of the millennium CCM reminds me of special moments with my parents while I was an only kid (now I have four younger siblings). I remember being a child and wanting to figure out how to praise God and what worship was all about. I'm no where closer now then I was then and I find it fun to think back at my child-likeness.
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Post by nocturnaliridescence on Nov 6, 2016 18:36:35 GMT -6
Here's a song I heard in a commercial a lot when I was younger: Shout to the NorthDoesn't sound bad! A little... overproduced, I guess, but nice! Here's a more "contemporary" reworking of a hymn I absolutely love: Near the CrossNot sure if it's "from the turn of the millennium" but it's the same kind of style. By the way Thomas, I LOVE that song you posted. Reminds me of the songs we sing at my church, just... without the organ!
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 6, 2016 18:42:16 GMT -6
Does the Church of Christ have something against CCM? I'm not familiar with their views. LOL
I'm not saying it has zero worship value for everyone, just me. ...and these types of songs were in my childhood too.
Probably why I can't stand them now.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 6, 2016 20:46:30 GMT -6
When just a few people gather around with an acoustic guitar and maybe a djembe or shakers and sing any worship song. It is truly special. The purity to that worship is far greater than any official congregational worship service I'm sure it can be spiritual in the right context, but I haven't seen it myself. Bad bible camp memories. Dudes with guitars everywhere that have figured out they can be crawling with females if they swoon about Jesus around them.
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Post by nocturnaliridescence on Nov 6, 2016 22:19:49 GMT -6
Here's a song used in a couple videos on Emperador's YT channel. Pastor Vampire never got back to me on what the song is, but I've always found it to have a very "powerful" sound.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 7, 2016 2:03:35 GMT -6
That sounds interesting for worship music. I don't know. I think I've got a mental block / thinking error regarding guitars in worship. I don't know if that's because I play guitar and they distract me? Or if it's the steel sound of the strings that jars the experience for me. Any percussion would be the same way.
Church organs have a very soft lulling sound. They're not distracting to me.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2016 7:43:13 GMT -6
The keyboards are so loud at the church I go to that you can't even hear the guitars and bass most of the time.
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Post by Bartimaeus on Nov 7, 2016 11:19:46 GMT -6
I love "Sacred Harp" singing like what Thomas posted above. The history is interesting and it really is powerful. This is one of my favorites.
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Post by thevociferator on Nov 7, 2016 12:10:44 GMT -6
Well I guess we're going down this road I might as well.
All I have learned this far in my spiritual life is that worship is state of mind in which one can only think of and thank the one he worships. Emotionally, it's a connection between hearts and expressing how one feels. Physically it's just spending time with the one you worship.
There can be many physical manifestations as to how this appears and every person is different. What puts a person in this state of mind can be different as well, however a spiritually mature christian has the ability the worship God in any circumstance no matter the distractions.
According to this definition, worship music is not a specified style. You can have any instrument and vocal style and it would still be worship music. To judge a worship band, one must not look at the ability play an instrument but rather the ability to help others enter the presence of God. "Leading worship".
But beyond that I do not know much. I have forgotten why specifically we must have worship at church, the importance of corporate worship, and the comparing and contrasting corporate and individual worship.
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Post by grendel on Nov 7, 2016 14:36:37 GMT -6
when it Comes to worship I have only that Snubnose - Second Hand Cover Album in mind: it helps me while not having congregational worship...
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 7, 2016 15:27:33 GMT -6
Worship in general is as broad as is our ability to communicate. When it comes to musical worship, I obviously have conviction. ...but that doesn't mean I discredit the ways people worship. If CCM gets you closer to God, pile it on man.
I don't know if you've read any Orationem lyrics, but there's a few tracks that have a prayer worship approach. While all these lyrics inspire me, and exercise my spirituality, I still wouldn't call it worship music.
Why?
...because Orationem is black metal. This is an entertaining genre of music and that's what Orationem is. Entertaining. Worship and entertainment to me are two very different things musically, and in my opinion/conviction, they clash.
CCM to me is in the same boat as CBM. While obviously Christian and being a joyful influence, the music is too focused on fun to be REAL worship music.
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Post by Kerrick on Nov 7, 2016 16:06:51 GMT -6
There's also an air of ecstasy about it too, like everyone makes freakin' O faces while they sing it. There's too much into it for concert appeal as well. My heart says that whooping and clapping isn't for Christ. Its for the acknowledgement of the singers, at least that's what it feels like to me.Yup, I would tend to agree. Worship is something that in the past year or so especially, I've done a lot of thought on. Just what IS worship? Do we need to be emotionally "moved" by it to enter into it or to be "more worshipful"? I see so many people get SO into it and my initial reaction is to assume I am less spiritual, less worshipful, and less honoring to God because I'm not wiggling around and waving my hands too. But then I wonder as Thomas has: is this song they're singing more about them or God? Something interesting is to look at the lyrics of much of what we consider as "worship" these days: it's vastly about the singers' emotions, feelings, and the like - not God. The lyrics of the first two songs posted I think fit in that category. Well I guess we're going down this road I might as well. All I have learned this far in my spiritual life is that worship is state of mind in which one can only think of and thank the one he worships. Emotionally, it's a connection between hearts and expressing how one feels. Physically it's just spending time with the one you worship. There can be many physical manifestations as to how this appears and every person is different. What puts a person in this state of mind can be different as well, however a spiritually mature christian has the ability the worship God in any circumstance no matter the distractions. According to this definition, worship music is not a specified style. You can have any instrument and vocal style and it would still be worship music. To judge a worship band, one must not look at the ability play an instrument but rather the ability to help others enter the presence of God. "Leading worship". But beyond that I do not know much. I have forgotten why specifically we must have worship at church, the importance of corporate worship, and the comparing and contrasting corporate and individual worship. This reminds me of the thread I started a while ago. I should revisit it as I notice I didn't respond to y'all's posts! theblackestlight.freeforums.net/thread/592/worshiping-god-music"...worship is a state of mind... expressing how one feels..." Do you care to elaborate? I'm not sure I'd agree, though I'm obviously still trying to figure out just what worship is and what it isn't. If CCM gets you closer to God, pile it on man. Agreed... but I'd like to clarify that this shouldn't be the case in worship (which you did address in what I quoted from you above). Also, I'd add if it helps you get closer to God, because there is no other way to the Father except through the Son.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 7, 2016 16:59:41 GMT -6
Worship to me isn't so much emotion, its feeling, revering, praising God with the utmost sincerity from your heart. If CCM or a grunge sounding church band is how you know to worship, who am I to say they're doing it wrong. I just don't get where I need to get with my worship, with contemporary/popular/mainstream/cool music.
As far as corporate or church worship, I haven't been to church in almost 10 years. Don't prescribe much to corporate Christianity, but I gather with others weekly in His name. (well, more like every other week the past few months because of chemotherapy)
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Post by nocturnaliridescence on Nov 7, 2016 19:42:24 GMT -6
Worship to me is just what the word implies - praising something or someone, in this case God (triune). Worship can be done any number of ways - prayer, singing, artwork, even just pointing out good things that God has done in conversation. Worship is more about the "why" than the "how". Of course there are ways God doesn't want us to worship (hence Deu 12:30- 31) but as long as our methods don't contradict scripture, I don't see an issue. The generic "worship" music of today can theoretically be genuine. GotQuestions article I found that might be relevant
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Post by thevociferator on Nov 7, 2016 20:16:31 GMT -6
That article was very abstract and theological.
My problem with worahip is that I got very little idea how to worship concretely. I struggle with how to physically and concretely worship God.
So then I ask is it just half state of mind and half performance art. If this is the case then why does there need to be music in the first place?
I lack a practical understanding of worship.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 8, 2016 7:27:35 GMT -6
Worship is more about the "why" than the "how". Very true. Excellent point. My problem with worahip is that I got very little idea how to worship concretely. I struggle with how to physically and concretely worship God. So then I ask is it just half state of mind and half performance art. If this is the case then why does there need to be music in the first place? Another good point, worship doesn't need to be music. At all. Most of my worship is prayer based, mostly because at this point in my life, I'm stuck sick at home. I know I mentioned I wouldn't consider Orationem to be worship music, even though some lyrics qualify. ...but the act of me creating something that publicly praises God, is a form of me worshiping God. This goes back to the why not the how. I could have themed Orationem to have secular topics, but I chose instead to devote this passion to God's glory. I'm probably a weirdo for looking at it that way, but that's where my heart leads. Ben, let your heart through God lead you to a satisfactory outlet of worship. It's not what you do to worship, or what any other person and their opinion has to say about it, it's up to YOU and GOD, my friend. Seek and ye shall find. If it's CCM for you, then that's great! If you think that's not quite enough, then look for "enough". The last thing worship should be is too complicated. I'm sure if God looks at our intentions and finds them pure, He will be pleased... regardless of the details of what we're doing to praise/glorify Him.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 8, 2016 7:42:41 GMT -6
Also, I'd add if it helps you get closer to God, because there is no other way to the Father except through the Son. Warning. Off topic tangent. I always thought the correct context of Christ saying to get to The Father, you have to get/go through Christ. ...was to get people/the disciples to stop talking to the sky when God (the Son) was right there in front of them.
Jesus Christ is 100% God, 100% man, right?
Do Christians really think people will get smacked into hell if they go to God the Father rather than God the Son? Really?
That's like me getting pissed because someone made my Christmas card out to "Tom the brother" rather than "Tom the Uncle". Why? I'm both a brother and an uncle!
To me it's the same thing with God. God is God. I want to go to ALL of Him, and I think God wants that as well. Apart from deciding to take that one verse at face value, it doesn't make sense that God still wants us to only broadcast to Christ who isn't even hear on earth anymore...
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Post by Kerrick on Nov 8, 2016 11:41:05 GMT -6
Do Christians really think people will get smacked into hell if they go to God the Father rather than God the Son? Really? Heh, that's a bit of a loaded question to which you already know the answer... I replied on CMR.
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Post by nocturnaliridescence on Nov 8, 2016 12:47:28 GMT -6
Do Christians really think people will get smacked into hell if they go to God the Father rather than God the Son? Really? I've always read it to mean that the only way to truly know God / the only way to God's eternal grace is through faith in Jesus.
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 8, 2016 22:40:35 GMT -6
Do Christians really think people will get smacked into hell if they go to God the Father rather than God the Son? Really? Heh, that's a bit of a loaded question to which you already know the answer... I replied on CMR. I replied to your reply.
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Post by thevociferator on Nov 8, 2016 23:20:47 GMT -6
okay.......could we go back to the original post
I still enjoy CCM every now and then. here's another song that isn't as old
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Post by Thomas Eversole on Nov 9, 2016 18:56:29 GMT -6
I enjoy some CCM music. Worship aside, there is some good Christian music out there. There's a few Carmen, Mark Lowry, Al Denson, Steve Camp songs from when I was a kid (now I'm showing my age!) that their music brings about an enjoyable nostalgia to me.
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Post by nocturnaliridescence on Nov 9, 2016 19:42:26 GMT -6
I'm curious what you guys think of this. It's a (really powerful!) gospel song with rock influences. Even a couple guitar solos!
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