|
Post by Thomas Eversole on Feb 8, 2017 11:56:29 GMT -6
Do you guys ever feel that dark forces are in play, trying to drag you down in your life and/or stop you from doing God's work?
I've got a recent example. The current record label that I'm on for Orationem is doing a re-release of the first two albums on one CD. Him and I have made 4-5 attempts to get that album uploaded for CD production and every attempt has failed! Shortening and even removing the intros and outros just would not burn. This is trying to put 75 minutes of music on an 80 minute CD, from standard WAV files (that I've used every release I've done), burning with no gaps, and it still would not fit!!! Never seen anything like it - between all the screenshots he sent to me, its not user error!
We FINALLY got it to work, but I had to make an unconventional change to the sound files to make this happen. With this music having a bold Christ centered message, and these problems we've never encountered before despite both me and the label having produced many other releases, its hard not to think evil is playing games.
...which brings me to the secondary point. How do we know when its actually evil, and just a "bad coincidence"?
Its not like anyone can prove things going wrong are Satan's touch, so it would obviously require a type of faith to believe there is unholy intervention.
Is there any harm for thinking circumstance X comes from darkness and circumstance Y comes from bad luck? How do we/you discern the two?
What are your thoughts?
|
|
|
Post by nocturnaliridescence on Feb 8, 2017 22:32:43 GMT -6
It's tough to tell, in cases like this, when something is directly influenced by evil forces and when it's just a coincidence. After everything that's happened in my life, I genuinely don't think it takes "faith" to believe in divine or unholy intervention; both are very observable phenomena in our world. The problem comes in when we're talking about things like technology, where it could just be a problem with the hardware, or it could be demonically influenced, and we don't have enough information to come to a proper conclusion. If we were talking about, say, an ouija board, all you'd have to do is check if there was any empirical force, like wind or people moving around a lot elsewhere in the house, that could have caused it to move. If not, then it's safe to say an evil spirit moved it. But with technology, you'd need someone to check out the program he's using, and then the hardware, then the sound files etc etc. It seems like a lot of people just assume it's always one or the other - either "it's demons!" or "lol ignurnt kchrischins its sciance", when it's not that simple. If you guys are having that many problems with this, I'd definitely say it's demonic forces at work, I just don't want to make assumptions. Is there any harm for thinking circumstance X comes from darkness and circumstance Y comes from bad luck? Well, the idea of "luck" can be kind of dangerous. ... But I feel like I'm just kind of nitpicking your words there. The only bad thing, I'd think, is if a person who's weak in faith thinks that something was caused by demons, but is later proven wrong. It might confuse them. On the other hand, most unbelievers don't have a proper understanding of demonic forces, so it's easier for those forces to confuse them, too. How do we/you discern the two? Compare Biblical and empirical views of the event(s) in question. I've gotten answers to prayers that I forgot I sent. (In 2014, I asked God for clarity on some things. A couple weeks later, I remembered those prayers and found that God had already answered me.) It's safe to say confirmation bias isn't at work there, because God answered things that weren't actively on my mind. But if one, say, prays for happiness and then their level of dopamine or serotonin increases, the possibility exists that that person just tricked their brain into feeling better before God Himself has intervened. But note, that's just a possibility. God might have still intervened in that case, too. As long as you remember that happiness isn't the ultimate goal in our lives, and that Jesus Himself said that we would face trouble in our lives ( John 16:33). Demonic activity promotes demonic agendas. Almost every time I want to work on Christian music, something distracts me or tempts me. The nudges that demonic forces give me entirely match the Biblical portrayal of them, and the Biblical definition of sin. Likewise, God gives me advice that matches His teachings in scripture, and matches the Biblical view of repentance and salvation. The Bible is the ultimate guidebook in life. But we also have to keep in mind that we're still psychological beings, and that we still look for meaning both where there is, and where there isn't meant to be any (like our instinct to look for facial features in everything). The important thing is to find a point in one's mind/spirit where objective and trustworthy Biblical truths aren't doubted, while keeping in mind that we might still look for meaning where God didn't intend any. Our psychological behaviors don't negate actual supernatural occurrences, but supernatural occurrences don't negate our psychological behaviors. Both are valid and play a part in our lives. I forgot how difficult it can be to explain things like this.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2017 8:08:13 GMT -6
Well, the idea of "luck" can be kind of dangerous. ... But I feel like I'm just kind of nitpicking your words there. I think a better term for this would be "random chance". I agree that the concept of luck doesn't really exist. Every single person has the same chance of rolling a six on a die, regardless of how "lucky" they might think they are. Suppose that you are playing a board game, and you can only win the game if you roll a six on your next turn. If you roll a six and end up winning the game, did that happen by chance or supernatural intervention? If you roll a four and lose the game, did that happen by chance or supernatural intervention? Though this is a rather trivial example, it still is interesting to think about and it is difficult to come to a conclusion.
|
|
|
Post by Thomas Eversole on Feb 10, 2017 12:42:01 GMT -6
I think a better term for this would be "random chance". I agree that the concept of luck doesn't really exist. Every single person has the same chance of rolling a six on a die, regardless of how "lucky" they might think they are. Well, the idea of "luck" can be kind of dangerous. ... But I feel like I'm just kind of nitpicking your words there. The only bad thing, I'd think, is if a person who's weak in faith thinks that something was caused by demons, but is later proven wrong. It might confuse them. On the other hand, most unbelievers don't have a proper understanding of demonic forces, so it's easier for those forces to confuse them, too. Random interjection, but I never understood some examples of the chance/probability thing. Evolutionists think the probability of a 300-molecule-long protein forming by total random chance is approximately 1 in 10 to the 390th power. Shouldn't they think the probability is 1 in 1 since it happened? I would agree with you in regards to rolling dice and everyone having the same "chance". ...but in regards to things like cancer, not so much. Genes and other hereditary things would say some people have a higher chance than others. For instances, my gastrointestinal specialist and my oncologist have both said that my immediate family (mom, dad, brother) are at a higher risk of cancer since they're my immediate family and I've had it. (They have a better chance of getting it compared to someone with no family history of cancer) Two of my doctors (with out being goaded to say it) stated that my cancer had nothing to do with what I did or didn't do, but it was "bad luck". I think luck comes in when chance (key word here) happens in your favor. Another example variable is that Ire: Blood Memory game I'm always geeked out about. There's a "chance" of getting a rare weapon to drop from mission NG3 5-5, and that chance is higher if you've invested in the Discovery skill. (someone having a discovery of 50% would indeed have a better chance than someone with a discovery of 15%, potentially) Luck does exist however. Good luck would be playing that mission once with 5% discovery and the weapon drops. Whereas "bad luck" would be grinding that mission for 4 hours with max Discovery and never seeing it. Both could happen. Both are chance. ...but what happens with that chance brings luck into play. _______________________________ I guess to further refine my question, is there a CHANCE forces of evil could effect someone in a way that has a physical manifestation? Obviously this did happen in the Bible ( Luke 13:10-13 is one example) but the real question is, can it still happen today? We can't prove it either way, but we can either say yes or no to the possibility of it. If a demon saps someone's dopamine/seratonin to nothing and makes them feel like crap, that is indeed a physical manifestation. (albeit rather hidden and again impossible to prove, but that would be a proper example) I think it comes down to these 3 points: a) If there is ANY chance the forces of darkness could do this, then any negative thing that happens in our lives is still on the table. b) If there is ZERO chance the forces of darkness could do something like this, then Satan has been named as the "prince", "god", or "ruler" of this world (John 14:30; John 12:31; 16:11; 2 Corinthians 4:3-4; Ephesians 2:2; Colossians 1:13) - all titles of "power" - then said power is complete fiction as he literally can't/won't/doesn't do anything to really effect us. c) Verificationism approach. Don't know. Can't know. So there's no real reason to even talk about it. A and B require their own faith (without proof) to subscribe to and C just wreaks of apathy. ...so which one do you guys choose?
|
|
|
Post by exo on Feb 10, 2017 14:45:57 GMT -6
I have ALWAYS approached this type of thing with a view not unlike C. More than that, I dare say that "apathy" to such things is the CORRECT approach. My faith......my salvation.....my security is in Christ. Why should I care about "demonic attacks"? At the end of the day, are they not irrelevant in the grand scheme? Why should even one sliver of a portion of my focus be diverted towards them, when it should be on God?
I have never understood other people's concerns with such things. We all know what the endgame of all this is if we have accepted Christ. Look to Job......are we not meant to persevere no matter if we are "under attack" or not?
That's not meant to be an indictment on anyone, or a questioning of someone else's faith or salvation......but the whole issue just seems so SIMPLE from my vantage point. It's not a matter of "am I being attacked", or whether or it I've been attacked in the past, or any of that stuff. It's a matter of "why should I care about it? I know where the outcome lies...."
|
|
|
Post by nocturnaliridescence on Feb 10, 2017 21:02:19 GMT -6
is there a CHANCE forces of evil could effect someone in a way that has a physical manifestation? Yes. But I would argue that it can be proven sometimes.
|
|
|
Post by Thomas Eversole on Feb 13, 2017 10:28:09 GMT -6
I have ALWAYS approached this type of thing with a view not unlike C. More than that, I dare say that "apathy" to such things is the CORRECT approach. My faith......my salvation.....my security is in Christ. Why should I care about "demonic attacks"? At the end of the day, are they not irrelevant in the grand scheme? Why should even one sliver of a portion of my focus be diverted towards them, when it should be on God? I have never understood other people's concerns with such things. We all know what the endgame of all this is if we have accepted Christ. Look to Job......are we not meant to persevere no matter if we are "under attack" or not? That's not meant to be an indictment on anyone, or a questioning of someone else's faith or salvation......but the whole issue just seems so SIMPLE from my vantage point. It's not a matter of "am I being attacked", or whether or it I've been attacked in the past, or any of that stuff. It's a matter of "why should I care about it? I know where the outcome lies...." Very true, and you're right about the big picture. Even though I've tried my best to live the saying "Don't sweat the small stuff and everything's small", there's still some things I've struggled with and I need to "talk it out" with God and others. In a strange way, bad happenings push me towards a greater realization of how much I need God. I mean, if everything went great and it was just us and God kicking it on this planet, my magnificent magnifying mind would probably eventually draw some conclusion that I don't need God "that much" because evil isn't real and I got this on my own.
|
|
|
Post by exo on Feb 13, 2017 17:37:37 GMT -6
Like I said, man, that's just MY vantage point. Not everyone can just lock in and focus like that. Part of the beauty of life is how different we all are
|
|
|
Post by Thomas Eversole on Feb 13, 2017 18:12:11 GMT -6
Well, I wish I had your vantage point actually! LOL
|
|